The most important news of the day is that we got our slide fixed. We were up and at it this morning to pull into our dealership at 8 AM. There aren’t really appointments for service. They tell you the day to come in. For everybody coming in on that day, it’s first come, first served. We fully expected it to take the better part of the day so we had plenty on our list to do.
Our first stop was at Camping World for new light covers. All of the 12 volt lights in our motorhome have those plastic covers. We noticed a few days ago that one of them had a hole in it where the heat from the bulb had, over time, damaged the plastic. I decided it was a fire hazard, so took those plastic covers off the three lights we use often. We decided to go with the LED lights instead of those hot bulbs. They didn’t have our size plastic covers, so we still have one with a hole in it. May have to order that online.
Our next stop was REI, but we had to pass right by Krispy Kreme Donuts before getting to REI. No sense in letting that opportunity go to waste. We haven’t had a Krispy Kreme since Christmas; might not have even had a donut since then. We were way overdue.
At REI I finally bought a new pack. I’ve been carrying a Kelty Redwing day pack for about 15 years. I love Kelty packs and own both a day pack and a backpack. At one time, I had three Kelty packs. But, their new day packs I don’t like as well. I went with an REI Lookout 40. It’s on the large size for a day pack at 40 liters, but I like a large pack for winter hiking when I take a bulky jacket and also for those times when I want to take my SLR. I can put the whole camera bag inside my pack. There are also lash points on the pack to attach my tripod. I’ve also been known to take a soft sided cooler on a hike. The Lookout is rated to carry up to 40 pounds comfortably. That’s way more than I want to carry on a day hike, but at least I know the camera, a heavy jacket, or a lot of water shouldn’t be a problem. I transferred all my stuff this afternoon and walked around some. It feels really good. The real test will be a hike. We’ve got rain in the forecast for the next 3 days so it may not happen until next week. I left all the tags on just in case it turns out I don’t like it.
REI is not too far from my parents’ home so we drove over there to visit with them and spend the rest of the day. We were really surprised when our dealer called after we’d been there only about an hour. We rushed off to get our home and make the trip back to Montgomery Bell State Park. The site we left was still open, so we’re right back where we started from.
It’s great to have the slide out again. Even though we can get to everything with it in, and it’s only 2 feet deep, it makes a tremendous difference in living space. I feel like I’m living in a mansion.
That’s it for today. Thanks for tagging along.
Showing posts with label RV Maintenance. Show all posts
Showing posts with label RV Maintenance. Show all posts
Wednesday, March 21, 2012
Monday, March 12, 2012
Not The Day We Planned
We had another great evening with family last night at the end of which we gave and got hugs and kisses all around. Our plan was to leave Perry this morning for Vogel State Park in north Georgia. We weren’t in a big hurry to get on the road. Certainly didn’t want to hit Macon or Atlanta until the rush hour was well past. About 9:30 we were finally ready to unplug the electricity, pull in the slides and leave.
It was the dinette slide that was the problem. It would begin to retract on the forward side, but would stop when the aft side wouldn’t budge. Gene spent the next hour on the phone with the Four Winds service representative. Then he spent the next hour trying to find a mobile repair service to come out to take a look.
George finally came early afternoon, but the diagnosis was not what we expected. According to the Four Winds service representative, problems like this are usually caused by some foreign object (like a cat toy, for example) getting stuck in the mechanism or a broken shear pin. All of the components of the slide mechanism are working fine. The problem--the slide had dropped below the edge of the glide plate on the aft side preventing it from retracting. George used a jack to lift that side up so that it could be retracted. It’s in now and we won’t put it out again until we take it into our dealer for service which won’t be until a week from Wednesday. Fortunately, we can get to everything with that slide in, it’s just a little less spacious.
After George left, Gene went up and extend for another night here at Fair Harbor and reconnected our utilities. Our plan now is to continue with our plan; we’ll just lose a day of hiking in north Georgia.
This pretty much consumed our entire day, so there isn’t anything else to report. Thanks for tagging along.
It was the dinette slide that was the problem. It would begin to retract on the forward side, but would stop when the aft side wouldn’t budge. Gene spent the next hour on the phone with the Four Winds service representative. Then he spent the next hour trying to find a mobile repair service to come out to take a look.
George finally came early afternoon, but the diagnosis was not what we expected. According to the Four Winds service representative, problems like this are usually caused by some foreign object (like a cat toy, for example) getting stuck in the mechanism or a broken shear pin. All of the components of the slide mechanism are working fine. The problem--the slide had dropped below the edge of the glide plate on the aft side preventing it from retracting. George used a jack to lift that side up so that it could be retracted. It’s in now and we won’t put it out again until we take it into our dealer for service which won’t be until a week from Wednesday. Fortunately, we can get to everything with that slide in, it’s just a little less spacious.
After George left, Gene went up and extend for another night here at Fair Harbor and reconnected our utilities. Our plan now is to continue with our plan; we’ll just lose a day of hiking in north Georgia.
This pretty much consumed our entire day, so there isn’t anything else to report. Thanks for tagging along.
Monday, April 11, 2011
Being Towed Saves on Fuel
We are thinking every positive thought we can come up with.
We were up and at um this morning. Normally, I don’t do much about putting stuff away. Oh, sure, I put the pictures away, and move the hand soup and lotion to the bathroom sink, and toss a few things in the kitchen sink, but I don’t worry about the toaster and coffee pot, or even the napkin basket on the table. Things ride pretty well in our RV. Today, however, I knew our tow truck driver would be driving a lot faster than we do and the front in would be sticking up at a nice angle. I secured everything I could think of and it took a while.
Ford MH emergency service called right at the stroke of 8 AM and kept us posted throughout the morning on progress he was making finding a Ford service center which met all the Ford MH criteria. They finally found a dealership in Colorado Springs which could take us today. We were all hitched up and on the road by 11.
Our same tow truck driver we had yesterday was back this morning to take care of us. He did another outstanding job today. Halfway through our drive to Colorado Springs he pulled off the interstate. We were nervous something had gone wrong, but he was only checking to be sure all his hook ups were still hooked up.
The service representative who will be taking care of our job met us in the parking lot at the service center. That has never happened in all the years of having cars and trucks serviced. We were impressed. He took Gene right in and got everything filled out. He even looked up hotel phone numbers for us. We were using the Exit Now guide so we knew what lodging was in the area. We were on our way to a motel within 30 minutes.
One of our main concerns for today was to have the drive shaft accompany us to the service facility. We had notes to ourselves all over the RV and every time anybody called about the RV we mentioned the drive shaft. I am happy to report that RV and drive shaft have been reunited.
To add a little spice to our morning, the air compressor failed. Gene has always been diligent to monitor the air pressure in the tires and today was no different. He especially wanted to be sure the pressure was correct on the rear tires since they would be rolling down the highway at 70 mph instead of our normal 60. The compressor was not filling the tires even though t was running. The thingy that attaches to the valve stem was not working properly and instead of putting air in the tire, it was allowing air to escape. We really needed air in one tire then. That resulted in another emergency service call to inform the towing service to bring along an air compressor.
We got settled in our motel room. Peanut was scared and hid under the bed for a long time. He finally got brave enough to come out and have his dinner. Gene went off to Lowes to purchase a new air compressor.
It wasn’t long before I noticed ants in the room. That’s not a good sign, especially with Peanut’s food out. While we were deciding whether to ask for ant bait or have someone come spray, the toilet overflowed. We spent the next 30 minutes moving to another room.
We haven’t slept out of our RV in a long time. Just finding a suitcase was a challenge. I had packed my stuff in Wal-Mart bags until Gene finally found the suitcase. I hope I haven’t forgotten anything. It’s hard to remember all the stuff you need when you are used to having everything you own with you. The bed bug thing is a real concern, but I’m not thinking about that other than to check the beds and try to keep our stuff in a safe place. After all, that’s not a positive thought.
The service representative says they still don’t know what the problem is. We have oil, and plenty of it, and we have oil pressure. That’s all good. They have determined it is not the oil pump, which is very good. They also determined it is not the electronic sender, which is what we were hoping it would be. They’ll continue their search and call us tomorrow.
So here we are in a motel in Colorado Springs with snow-capped mountains out our window. It turned out to be a beautiful day, by the way. It was very cold last night--down to about 25. We even got a couple snow flakes yesterday afternoon and a fresh layer of snow was on the mountain tops this morning.
That’s about all I know today. Thanks for tagging along
Sunday, April 10, 2011
Sunday's Adventure
This day did not go like any of our plans were written. This was one of those adventures you really don’t want to have, but you know us. We like to get the most out of every trip.
This story really begins on Saturday afternoon. Just as we were getting off the interstate and pulling into Wal-Mart the “check oil” light started to blink. That’s never a good sign, but at least we were where we were going for the day. We parked and Gene let the engine cool down a little before checking the oil. We had all kinds of oil--it was up to the high mark on the dip stick. Then he started the engine and, behold, no “check oil” light and everything looked good. As a precaution, however, just in case there was a leak, he bought another quart of oil at Wal-Mart to go with the spare we always have.
This morning, we pulled out of Wal-Mart and into the Shell station for gas--filled up the motor home and the car. Ouch. More on that later.
We had decided to only drive about 60 miles toward Great Sand Dunes today. Their weather forecast was not that good so we thought we’d just get a little closer and stay at a campground with full hook-ups to wait for the weather to improve.
We got on the interstate (I-25) northbound and drove 8 miles up to the next rest area. There we called to be sure the campground we had selected was open. Back on the interstate, we drove about 10 more miles when the “check oil” light came on and the oil pressure gauge showed low. That’s never a good sign. Gene immediately pulled over onto the shoulder. After waiting a few minutes for the oil to settle, he checked the oil. Still full.
Gene called the Ford Motor Home hotline and after a few dropped calls and a lengthy conversation, they sent out a tow truck. We sat on the side of the interstate for perhaps an hour all together. During that time, two state police officers stopped to investigate about 15 minutes apart. Satisfied that it truly was an emergency and that we had things under control, they encouraged us to call if we needed anything and they returned to their job of keeping Colorado safe.
Unlike that time in Connecticut when we had a flat on the Everest 5th wheel and the emergency service sent out a mini van driven by a 12 year old equipped with a tire iron, this time we got a real tow truck and a driver/mechanic who knew what he was doing. Although it was a sad sight, he had us hitched up in no time. Then when he dropped us off at the campground, he help us get level. That’s great service. I don’t recommend needing a tow, but if you ever do and you’re in southern Colorado, Kelly is the one to call.
Wish I’d thought to make a picture of our drive shaft being disconnected. That’s never a good sign. Anyway, I didn’t, but that may be the story for tomorrow--where in the world is the drive shaft. Last we saw it was in the tow truck and who knows which truck will come for us tomorrow. We have notes stuck all over the motor home reminding us to ask about the drive shaft.
At this point, we really don’t know what the problem is. After talking with the Ford service tech, they apparently think it’s some sort of warranty issue. That’s good news, cause now Ford is happy to pay for the towing and the repairs. Since we’re probably going to have to be towed to Pueblo, which isn’t just around the corner, we’re happy for Ford to pay the bill, too.
For today, Kelly Towing Service towed the motor home back to Trinidad and we’re in not so fine a campground behind the Budget Summit Inn. It’ll do. We have a great view of the snow-capped mountains and full hook-ups. And Ford’s probably gonna pay the bill for here, too.
I’m sure you’ll agree--life doesn’t get much better. Or maybe this is one of those “box of chocolate” moments.
Monday, July 12, 2010
Truck Repairs
That time has come again--the time to take the truck for service. It seems like it rolls around all too often. Then again, being in travel mode twelve months a year, we put a lot of miles on the truck.
Gene drove over to Litchfield this morning to the Ford dealership. About mid-morning the phone rang and when I answered he said he had “bad news and bad news”. Now, I’m no expert on truck stuff, but this didn’t sound good. I asked for the bad news first and indeed it was bad news--there is a leak in the fuel tank. I really couldn’t think of anything to say so he went on with the bad news. There is also an exhaust leak where the pipe (or whatever gizmo) comes out of (or is attached to) the engine. Again, I couldn’t quite think of anything to say so he went on with the bad news. Apparently, our truck is just riddled with holes because there is an oil leak at the base of the engine. He came home a couple hours later after renting a car from Enterprise.
The good news is we get to drive a little car for a few days while the truck is repaired and our bank account is drained. Speaking of draining things, I wonder what will happen to that almost full tank of diesel fuel.
There really is some good news in all this--all the engine stuff is still under warranty. To fix the oil leak the engine has to be dropped and, naturally, all the oil drained so we won’t have to pay for the oil change. Still, with the new fuel tank and the other 90,000 mile scheduled maintenance items, we get to cough up well over $2,000. That’s plenty, thank you.
This evening we’re recovering from the shock. Tomorrow, we’ll go for a nice, long hike to get the blood flowing again.
Tuesday, October 6, 2009
Service on the Everest
I am happy to report that almost all those things that were not working properly, fell off during the trip from Washington, or were otherwise broken are now fixed and in proper working order.
Like an automobile, RVs go into the service bay for repairs rather than the service man coming to you. Of course, there are mobile repair services, but for our warranty work we needed to take the Everest to an Everest dealer. The closest one was in Columbia, south of Nashville. Our appointment was at 10 AM, so we were in the tail end of morning rush hour traffic. Traffic thinned out south of the city and we had a pleasant ride on into Columbia.
Since we purchased the Everest in Albuquerque in April we have been compiling a list of things that needed attention. About a month ago Gene emailed the list to the service manager and he ordered all the parts which we needed. Even though our list was pretty long, most everything was minor and they were able to complete all our work by mid-afternoon. The only thing which didn’t get fixed was the hinge on the cabinet. Keystone (the manufacturer) had sent a door hinge instead of a cabinet hinge. It is really a simple task, so when the cabinet hinge comes in we will pick it up and install it ourselves.
The dealership was small and didn’t have the waiting rooms like large dealerships or Camping World, so we drove over to McDonalds. We spend some time in the truck with the Peanut. For lunch we went to Cracker Barrel. We had heavy rains this afternoon, but they had passed out of the area by the time we were hitched up and driving back through downtown Nashville. Thankfully, we were just a little ahead of the afternoon rush hour.
We are once again set up in the site we left this morning and plan to stay here until after the holidays except for a short trip to the Smokies the first of November.
Not a very exciting day but certainly one that needed to the done. Tomorrow is supposed to be sunny; we’re planning another hike.
Thursday, March 19, 2009
Plumbing Issues Resolved
Hallelujah, I can use my sink.
Charles came out this morning and after a couple hours had the galley tank in working order again. He called his repair “welding”, but it was really more like hot glue gun. Basically, he put a bead of hot glue-like substance along the crack which supposedly melted the plastic of the tank and, when set, formed a strong enough bond between glue and plastic to prevent leaking. If this doesn’t work, then a new tank will be in our future. We have our fingers crossed.
We were very pleased with Charles. He apparently worked construction and lived in his RV for 12 years traveling from job to job. Between him and the rest of the crew, there was always something that needed to be fixed on one of the RVs. He liked the work. When his wife suggested they settle some place more permanent, he went to RV tech school and opened his own shop. The lady in the campground office said he was very good, so good, in fact, that he is hard to get on short notice. We were lucky.
While he was here he looked at the black tank scrubber issue we were dealing with a couple months ago. He pulled the connection out and looked at it, but couldn’t find anything wrong. He put it back in and it seems to be working fine now. It’s a miracle.
Our plumbing issues seem to all be resolved and we are planning to pull away from here in the morning. We will be cutting it close, but we think we will still be able to stay a week at Big Bend and still have time to visit Guadalupe Mountains and Carlsbad Caverns before we have to be at the Rally in Albuquerque the middle of April.
Charles came out this morning and after a couple hours had the galley tank in working order again. He called his repair “welding”, but it was really more like hot glue gun. Basically, he put a bead of hot glue-like substance along the crack which supposedly melted the plastic of the tank and, when set, formed a strong enough bond between glue and plastic to prevent leaking. If this doesn’t work, then a new tank will be in our future. We have our fingers crossed.
We were very pleased with Charles. He apparently worked construction and lived in his RV for 12 years traveling from job to job. Between him and the rest of the crew, there was always something that needed to be fixed on one of the RVs. He liked the work. When his wife suggested they settle some place more permanent, he went to RV tech school and opened his own shop. The lady in the campground office said he was very good, so good, in fact, that he is hard to get on short notice. We were lucky.
While he was here he looked at the black tank scrubber issue we were dealing with a couple months ago. He pulled the connection out and looked at it, but couldn’t find anything wrong. He put it back in and it seems to be working fine now. It’s a miracle.
Our plumbing issues seem to all be resolved and we are planning to pull away from here in the morning. We will be cutting it close, but we think we will still be able to stay a week at Big Bend and still have time to visit Guadalupe Mountains and Carlsbad Caverns before we have to be at the Rally in Albuquerque the middle of April.
Wednesday, March 18, 2009
Another Delay
Thankfully, the medical procedure turned out to show no abnormalities and we began in earnest to be ready to travel tomorrow. However, this morning as I was standing in the kitchen preparing the pasta salad to go with the salmon I cooked yesterday, I heard a slight “pop” and at the same time felt a slight vibration under my feet. These things were followed by a foul odor in the kitchen. I got that feeling that we all have sometimes that things are just not quite right.
I opened the window to see if I could tell if the odor was coming from outside. I immediately heard water running—not a good sign. Gene and I went outside to discover water pouring out of the area around the galley tank valve.
The first thing Gene did after opening the valve and draining the tank, was to contact the office for a recommendation on a mobile repair service. After calling the service recommended and leaving a message, the waiting began. With no call back after 3 hours, he called the next number on the list. He got an answer from this one, and he agreed to come by this afternoon about 4ish. He was a little late getting here, but not bad, however, he announced right away that he couldn’t stay long. He just wanted to take a quick look and maybe give us an idea what was going on. He was here about an hour. When I went outside to take a look myself, I was surprised to find the rear stabilizers lying on the ground. I got back inside as quickly as possible.
Charles finally left and Gene came inside with the diagnosis—yes, indeed, the tank is cracked. The good news is Charles thinks he can weld it back together. He’s coming back in the morning. If that doesn’t work, then we get to purchase a new tank. But we’re not thinking about that right now. Right now we are confident Charles can do his stuff, and then we can be back on the road again.
Charles was not really clear about what time he’ll be back in the morning. We, of course, are not sure how long the repair will take. So we are not counting on being able to leave here until Friday.
We are fortunate in that this happened while we were still near San Antonio where there are mobile repair services and many RV dealerships (3 of which are almost within sight of our campground). It would have been very stressful for this to have happened in a Wal-Mart parking lot on the way to Big Bend where there was no sewer connection to empty the tank into. Or worse yet, while we were at Big Bend where there would be no mobile repair service and perhaps no RV dealerships.
So, we are waiting to see what tomorrow brings.
I opened the window to see if I could tell if the odor was coming from outside. I immediately heard water running—not a good sign. Gene and I went outside to discover water pouring out of the area around the galley tank valve.
The first thing Gene did after opening the valve and draining the tank, was to contact the office for a recommendation on a mobile repair service. After calling the service recommended and leaving a message, the waiting began. With no call back after 3 hours, he called the next number on the list. He got an answer from this one, and he agreed to come by this afternoon about 4ish. He was a little late getting here, but not bad, however, he announced right away that he couldn’t stay long. He just wanted to take a quick look and maybe give us an idea what was going on. He was here about an hour. When I went outside to take a look myself, I was surprised to find the rear stabilizers lying on the ground. I got back inside as quickly as possible.
Charles finally left and Gene came inside with the diagnosis—yes, indeed, the tank is cracked. The good news is Charles thinks he can weld it back together. He’s coming back in the morning. If that doesn’t work, then we get to purchase a new tank. But we’re not thinking about that right now. Right now we are confident Charles can do his stuff, and then we can be back on the road again.
Charles was not really clear about what time he’ll be back in the morning. We, of course, are not sure how long the repair will take. So we are not counting on being able to leave here until Friday.
We are fortunate in that this happened while we were still near San Antonio where there are mobile repair services and many RV dealerships (3 of which are almost within sight of our campground). It would have been very stressful for this to have happened in a Wal-Mart parking lot on the way to Big Bend where there was no sewer connection to empty the tank into. Or worse yet, while we were at Big Bend where there would be no mobile repair service and perhaps no RV dealerships.
So, we are waiting to see what tomorrow brings.
Tuesday, November 18, 2008
How Many RVers Does It Take to Screw In a Light Bulb?
Contributed by Gene
As dusk began to fall I switched on the wall lamp over the desk. It flashed on – and then off. Switch Switch. No light. The ceiling light worked so it appeared that this was a localized problem.
The wall lamp had two small bulbs. Actually, we have four wall lamps like this one. All 4 lamps use different bulbs. I wonder why. Anyway, this wall lamp at the desk has 2 round bulbs. When I removed the bulbs, other than the top of the bulb being dark, they looked fine. The filament appeared to be intact. Couldn’t hear anything when I shook them.
“I hope it’s not the lamp itself,” I worried. Judi suggested I check the fuse panel. That is what the manual says, I remember. It says to always check the fuse first. How could she know that? She never looks at the manuals.
I check both the alternating current and direct current fuse panels. Everything was fine.
“Maybe it’s a loose wire,” said Judi. Please God, I thought, just this once let her be wrong. “I’m going to run over to Camping World for some new bulbs,” sez I.
The parts man couldn’t see anything wrong with the old bulbs. But since it was 5:20 in the afternoon, the tools were all locked up so he couldn’t test the bulbs with a volt meter. He assured me new bulbs could be returned, so I accepted a package. No price marked. At the checkout I was prepared for the worst. Some specialized RV bulbs, who knew what they might cost? The answer was $2.18.
Back home I inserted 1 new bulb which burned brightly a second then went out. On no! A lamp that kills bulbs. “Why don’t you check the fuses?” Because, Judi, I thought, I already checked them and they were fine.” But I checked, stalling for time to decide what to do next.
Imagine my surprise to see that a DC fuse had blown.
When the RV was new, in November 2005, I bought a package of 30 amp and a package of 15 amp DC fuses. I bought them right after reading the owner’s manual about always checking the fuses first whenever there is an electrical problem. I remember putting them away so they could be easily found when needed. I wonder where that was.
Now that it was dark out, I grabbed a flashlight to go root around in my tool box and parts box. Judi said, “Wait, check the kitchen drawer first.” Why not. Lo, I found them next to the Swiss Army knife and the candles. Judi is good. She is very, very good.
I replaced the 15 amp fuse, put the bulbs in the lamp, and switched it on. Let there be light! And brighter than before. Hosanna!
I sat down to enjoy my triumph. Then I thought I should put the fuses back before I forgot to. Now, where did I lay them?
As dusk began to fall I switched on the wall lamp over the desk. It flashed on – and then off. Switch Switch. No light. The ceiling light worked so it appeared that this was a localized problem.
The wall lamp had two small bulbs. Actually, we have four wall lamps like this one. All 4 lamps use different bulbs. I wonder why. Anyway, this wall lamp at the desk has 2 round bulbs. When I removed the bulbs, other than the top of the bulb being dark, they looked fine. The filament appeared to be intact. Couldn’t hear anything when I shook them.
“I hope it’s not the lamp itself,” I worried. Judi suggested I check the fuse panel. That is what the manual says, I remember. It says to always check the fuse first. How could she know that? She never looks at the manuals.
I check both the alternating current and direct current fuse panels. Everything was fine.
“Maybe it’s a loose wire,” said Judi. Please God, I thought, just this once let her be wrong. “I’m going to run over to Camping World for some new bulbs,” sez I.
The parts man couldn’t see anything wrong with the old bulbs. But since it was 5:20 in the afternoon, the tools were all locked up so he couldn’t test the bulbs with a volt meter. He assured me new bulbs could be returned, so I accepted a package. No price marked. At the checkout I was prepared for the worst. Some specialized RV bulbs, who knew what they might cost? The answer was $2.18.
Back home I inserted 1 new bulb which burned brightly a second then went out. On no! A lamp that kills bulbs. “Why don’t you check the fuses?” Because, Judi, I thought, I already checked them and they were fine.” But I checked, stalling for time to decide what to do next.
Imagine my surprise to see that a DC fuse had blown.
When the RV was new, in November 2005, I bought a package of 30 amp and a package of 15 amp DC fuses. I bought them right after reading the owner’s manual about always checking the fuses first whenever there is an electrical problem. I remember putting them away so they could be easily found when needed. I wonder where that was.
Now that it was dark out, I grabbed a flashlight to go root around in my tool box and parts box. Judi said, “Wait, check the kitchen drawer first.” Why not. Lo, I found them next to the Swiss Army knife and the candles. Judi is good. She is very, very good.
I replaced the 15 amp fuse, put the bulbs in the lamp, and switched it on. Let there be light! And brighter than before. Hosanna!
I sat down to enjoy my triumph. Then I thought I should put the fuses back before I forgot to. Now, where did I lay them?
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